Vidal - new midi controller being developed

Who called 911?😆

Pete14 I googled it

Just don't believe everything that's on the internet, @Pete14 …

Trust your instincts and go get those funds.

As you've written plenty of these Plans of Action before, along quite similar lines and recipes, I'm sure you'll pull it off.

Cheers and a happy heist,

HZ

PS By now @tom_vidal will never come back, thinking we're a sad bunch of utter nutcakes. Which we are, but we're also a serious Piano bunch with some very knowledgeable nutcakes as it comes to actions, sensors, readouts, MIDI streams and so on. Please do understand, Tom!

HZPiano Please do understand, Tom!

Yes, I’ve called the “Vidal” ugly, but that was the old me, Pete, talking; the new me, Petruska, is more open-minded and forgiving; so yes, ‘please do understand, Tom,’ I no longer believe your creation ‘ugly’, but rather ‘eccentric.’

Now, if you could stop by for a brief rendezvous, I, Petruska, promise a warm welcome; and I assure you, I will personally handle the weirdos ‘round here.

We await thee, Tom, we await thee with open arms (and a few well-intended questions).

Going back to the action mechanics... Why the springs? If the back of the key would lift a lever-like block (just like the back of the key lifts the damper in a real action...) wouldn't that give the same result? Easy to individually adjust weigths on both the back of the key and in that block to achieve grading (instead of adjusting spring tension), and easy to set up double blocks to simulate let-off. Vidal's own diagram of key weighting show how off their design is from the Steinway... Ok, it accomplishes weight reduction at key bottom, but the springs also cause linear increase of weight until key bottom, while in a grand action it does not increase until let-off... Why springs?

Is the magnet force for each one adjusted by physical distance of magnetics - so a screwdriver can make the magnetic go up or down - which changes attraction force? Or each one is electromagnetic, so that the force can be controlled precisely by a precisely controlled amount of current flowing through the electromagnets? (such as in the mag-levs etc). And also - as the number of sensor pads is two, instead of three. So tracking of the the states (including direction and position of hammer/key) of the key mechanism is most likely done with other sensors in the unit, right? For tracking of where the key and 'hammer' at all times - including direction and velocities. It's most likely all sorted at this stage.

Good comment about the springs. Are the springs part of the final product? Or weights are used instead for the final.

vagfilm Going back to the action mechanics...

Thanks for that, @vagfilm !

Cheers and happy fruitful discussion,

HZ

SouthPark

When I got a similar idea (to tackle the widespread upweight/letoff issue) last year, that was indeed using controllable electromagnets. Vidal's, as I get it, are static magnets in the keybed. They attract a screw in each key, which can be turned (and thus the distance to the magnet changed) to adjust the effect.

Vidal's sensors appear to be conventional double rubber domes. Which in my mind should be triples instead or better still continuous opticals.

The springs are there and will be in the production units exactly so.

If you're interested, read the corresponding article at their site, it sketches out a lot of their design (which is very nice that they give such explanations in the first place).

Cheers and happy further reading,

HZ

vagfilm double blocks to simulate let-off

That sounds interesting, what do you have in mind there?

Cheers and happy ideas,

HZ

HZPiano Thanks for adding those nice details HZ!

The website has been updated to show the action.

https://playvidal.com/products/vidal

Johnstaf The website has been updated to show the action.

Hello,

Actually, I don't see any new information nor new action images (compared to some months ago)?

Cheers and happy weekend,

HZ

Yes, I also think I've already seen all these pictures before. BTW, what's going on with Vidal, are there any units shipped already, any reviews?

They’re saying that the “first batch” has been sold out, and a wait is in place for those wanting to buy one at the moment.

BTW, I noticed the 88-key version costs over four 4K; can anyone tell me what makes this desk-with-keys so special? (Yes, I know about the magnets, and……).

CyberGene BTW, what's going on with Vidal, are there any units shipped already, any reviews?

My thoughts exactly. Would be quite interesting to see reviews from knowledgeable (please…), independent first users.

Pete14 costs over four 4K; can anyone tell me what makes this desk-with-keys so special?

Typical small/initial production run, early adopter, market skimming pricing. Thus trying to overcome development- and startup costs.

Cheers and happy developments watching,

HZ

HZPiano Typical small/initial production run, early adopter, market skimming pricing. Thus trying to overcome development- and startup costs.

So, then, this means I have to pickup the bill? No, thank you very much!

I shan’t be expected to pay for the “getting-started costs” in the hopes that things even out past the starting-point at Vidal; instead they should try to enlist a millionaire capable of absorbing the initial losses!

The way it goes, normally: you lose money for the first couple o’ years in the hopes that once the company truly takes off, so do the profits, but they should not expect me to pay for the ‘initial’ losses on the basis that I’m supporting some kumbaya, fake-it-till-you-make-it dream!

I’m sorry, Vidal, but $4,399 can get me way more than a desk with magnets & keys……

Pete14 I’m sorry, Vidal, but $4,399 can get me way more than a desk with magnets & keys……

I hear you. That's one more reason I'm not an early adopter.

But do we really know for certain that this $4,399 figure constitutes getting-started costs or market skimming pricing ?

Let's put it this way ......... the person that chose to put the pitchbend lever/toothpick thing in that spot. Marching orders already. 1970 etc layout ...... tolerable. But putting pitchbend 'above' that dial/knob and button ... back to the drawing board fellas.

For 4400 bucks. At least get the pitchbend and mod wheels etc right.

I didn't think the videos of the action were there previously. Not when I last looked anyway.

Isn’t it easier to tinker with a virtual velocity curve rather than physically going in there to tinker with magnetic weights, I ask?

Can they guarantee a return/repair if I mess up the magnets whilst trying to adjust the weight from 40 to 80?

Also, will I get grease on my silky, baby-smooth hands whilst tinkering with them magnets?🧲

Pete14 Can they guarantee a return/repair if I mess up the magnets whilst trying to adjust the weight from 40 to 80? Also, will I get grease on my silky, baby-smooth hands whilst tinkering with them magnets?

Pete, you'll have to spend $4,399 before you can find out.