A brand new Steinway from VSL: 1887 model D concert grand

CyberGene It doesn't work exactly like that. It's only the loud attack portion of a note that has enough energy to excite the open strings (when all dampers are open). However, if you first play a note without the damper pedal and hold it and then press the damper pedal, the resonances will be much lower, especially if you pressed the pedal after the attack portion. In practice you might not even hear them once short time has elapsed. Just switching from the non-sustain sample to the sustain one is wrong and will lead to audible artifacts.

This works very well in Vienna Imperial. It's not an immediate transition to the pedal-down samples. The note "swells" like it does on a grand. It's quite subtle, but audible. If you touch the soundboard on a piano you can always feel vibrations as long as the sound is audible, and they'll excite the other strings as long as a note sounds. Vibrations are transmitted to all the strings whether the dampers are used or not -it's just that you can't hear them with the pedal up. In real life it takes a short while for the other strings to "catch up" when the dampers are lifted.

Incidentally, on some pianos the strings are never fully damped as the dampers are quite light. Staccato notes are just as short, but there's a tiny reverb tail afterwards. Old Bechstein grands are known for this. Duplex scaling on modern pianos has a similar effect, where the undamped pitched parts of the string ring out slightly after the note is stopped. A piano without duplex scaling and with heavy dampers can sound very dry. Duplex scaling can sometimes cause a dissonant whine. I often hear this on performances of Beethoven's Op.111 during the trills.

Jane Thanks Jane. This info is perfect! I’ll be trying this on my NV10s. If it sounds anything like what you’ve posted I’ll be happy.

Jane

Thanks for your contributions to this thread and the great playing. Interestingly, I ended up in a similar place to you. For the recording I want to do, this instrument has more character/vintage sound than I want for modern music but not as much as other instruments in the VSL library when I want to go wild on character. I love the German Upright, which is also an older instrument.

As such, the main reason I would want this is that it is beautiful on its own merits and the romanticism of the vintage and well-preserved instrument is lovely. I try to limit myself to one VSL piano per year, so I will revisit next year. For this year, I decided to spring for the Fazioli 308.

Having said all that, this instrument was a treat to try out. I can see why that blend of pristine sound with some vintage character could be perfect for some users, and the playability is fantastic. In my opinion, it is a much more balanced pick for general application from the studio series than all the other studio pianos except maybe the Bosendorfer 280vc, but that instrument is so bright in comparison that it comes down to which tone you like more. There aren't any genres that would sound bad on this instrument with the right present and reverb engine, and it adds its own charm and magnificence.

Paul/team, if you read this, please don't do the massive 50% deal before the new release next year lol. I feel like I missed out, although I love supporting the company, so not a huge deal. 🙂

Jane I'll try to post a recording of just a few chromatic scales so you can get a better sense of the naked notes.

This is quick. I tried to be even but obviously my touch is not.
Single chromatic notes and octave chromatic, with each of the three close mics.

Jane Thanks for this Jane. The chromatic note recordings should be very helpful for anyone who hasn’t installed and is curious about the existence of VSL piano dead notes.

Reddit Ask Me Anything with Paul Kopf and me.

CyberGene I didn’t mean there’s no resonance at all 🙂 But I’ve tested this on real pianos and after the initial loud attack, the excitation energy and the resulting resonances are rather low.

I did think there was no resonance at all, because I didn't hear it when I raised it from default -Inf to 0 dB (which I'd expect to be a "normal" level). But recently I installed the Fazioli studio demo and found an "easter egg", there is sympathetic string resonance after all if the knob is raised to +10 dB 😉

Is there a trick to make the key produce no sound if pressed very slowly? Moving the bottom-left point of the input curve doesn't seem to work.

_sem_ Is there a trick to make the key produce no sound if pressed very slowly?

https://forum.vsl.co.at/topic/55281/feature-suggestions-for-synchron-pianos
https://forum.vsl.co.at/topic/60430/silent-key-still-sounding-in-synchron-pianos
https://forum.vsl.co.at/topic/48702/synchron-piano-sympathetic-resonance-and-silent-key
https://forum.vsl.co.at/topic/53025/missing-silent-key-function
https://forum.vsl.co.at/topic/58779/synchron-pianos-silent-key-press-and-sympathetic-resonance-how-to

clavierhaus

What would you consider the appropriate level of string resonance that would match the real instrument?

It appears to me that the expected effect of already faded, still pressed key an octave higher, is when the resonance is somewhere around +10..+20 dB. However, the overall sound with the resonance setting that high appears degraded (as if we're somehow getting a double dose of resonance, one in the resonance effect and another already recorded in the samples without the effect).

Good morning All, I hope you will be able to help me.

I just started using the demo of 1887 studio. I love how it starts so quickly and the interface is very straightforward.

Coming from Pianoteq and then Vi Labs Modern D I am used to "too perfect" instruments and that's likely why I love this humanity/fragility of the 1887. However, when I press heavily the keys, I get quite a metallic sound. Particularly true for the D5 note. When I play piano, this unpleasant tone disappear. It a bit like a very light coin was lying on the string.

Because there is something I very like in this piano, I would like not to give up too soon and would be happy if you could explain to me what happens.

Thank ytou so much for your help.

Given C4 the middle C, I've found annoying D6 in many sampled pianos. Maybe it's the issue of my humble speakers. I tried to switch left channel to right channel. The distortion seems to disappear. Not all virtual pianos provide player and audience flap options. I have to do manually and exhange the position of my speakers as well. So, again that's bottom on the left and top register on the right. I only let Garritan CFX always sit in audience position ‘cause I feel that's more natural for my ears.

One thing left, VSL has a "Body" percent option on UI. Maybe that could fix a little bit.

Florian75 However, when I press heavily the keys, I get quite a metallic sound. Particularly true for the D5 note. When I play piano, this unpleasant tone disappear. It a bit like a very light coin was lying on the string.

I also notice the metallic coin-like sound on the D5 note. However, it doesn’t bother me when playing, and perhaps this is the vintage character of the piano, making it sound slightly imperfect.

Florian75 However, when I press heavily the keys, I get quite a metallic sound. Particularly true for the D5 note. When I play piano, this unpleasant tone disappear. It a bit like a very light coin was lying on the string.

Hallelujah ratamahatta!

jenpal

I also notice the metallic coin-like sound on the D5 note.
perhaps this is the vintage character of the piano, making it sound slightly imperfect.

Nothing "vintage" here, it is just rattling (from symph. vibration) of the equipment caused by loud sound.
All sample libraries suffer from such problems. All of them!

I noticed that VSL has an audio export feature, which is quite handy. I’m not sure if this is new. I recorded some Christian music using the Concert D 1887, and I think the quality is great without needing mastering through my Ableton Live.

jenpal

thanks jenpal.

I also believe that there is also the time for the ears and brain to adjust.

After 6 months of Modern D, you need some time to adjust, don’t you think?

Florian75
Yes, I think so. It’s incredible how our brains work. Sometimes stepping away for a while and then returning can change your perspective.

However, I have mild hearing loss in my right ear and tinnitus in both. So I’m not sure if that’s why I don’t mind the metallic sound.

Initially, I wasn’t a fan of vintage piano sounds but gradually grew to like them. My default VSL piano is the CFX, which is bright and remains my favourite but I sometimes prefer a drier vintage sound.

jenpal the good thing is that we are just a couple clicks away from playing a pristine modern Steinway D, or a 1887 vintage one, as an example. If you just had an acoustic piano, it would be slightly more difficult to do the same thing 😉

We are fortunate to have all these options at our disposal 🙏🏻

Jose EB5AGV the good thing is that we are just a couple clicks away from playing a pristine modern Steinway D, or a 1887 vintage one, as an example. If you just had an acoustic piano, it would be slightly more difficult to do the same thing….

My point exactly!

We don’t need that mammoth thing called “the acoustic,” and I challenge anyone who says otherwise! IMHO!

Pete14 My point exactly!

We don’t need that mammoth thing called “the acoustic,” and I challenge anyone who says otherwise!

This was not Jose’s point though 🙂 He (and I, and many others) appreciate the many advantages digitals have. But we’re not at war with the acoustic, we love it.

Pete14 I say otherwise!!! I love the acoustic, and I love the digital as well. But they are not exclusive to one another as you point out. And, I might add, since you don't even play the piano, you won't understand why we love both. To you, the acoustic is something worthy to be thrown in the trash. I say, not so fast! But since you don't understand it, there's no use shouting to the voide.