Pianos (keys) are badly designed!

Yet, questions are still here for any participant who would like to chime in and THINK, INVENT their own answer.
Not the copy-paste words they have read from a book written by another copy-paste academic.

Calling me a troll is an insult and it will backfire (trust me, I have seen a Music professor getting angry at my questions). If you (anyone) have nothing in mind to discuss and bring to the discussion, this thread is not for you. I do not mind. It is intended as a "placeholder" on the Internet for the search engines (eventually) although I would prefer participant to really think about the problems presented. Oh, you do not think there are problems! Good. Please, move on. There is no need to participate. It will only make you look stupid and childish. You just can't help yourself but to shit on other's people no matter how crazy or uncomfortable (for you) quests.

The forum has an Ignore function. Use it. I allready did for the following morons:
revox, MacMacMac, Pete14
Khuja is one moronic post from it.

PASHKULI If you (anyone) have nothing in mind to discuss and bring to the discussion, this thread is not for you. I do not mind. It is intended as a "placeholder" on the Internet for the search engines (eventually) although I would prefer participant to really think about the problems presented. Oh, you do not think there are problems! Good. Please, move on.

I think therefore you have a problem. If you think the only worthwhile contributors are others who agree with your basic premise, i.e., that the traditional piano keyboard is conceptually flawed then it's likely there will be no other contributors! Throughout your endeavours you've been a lone voice and you'll continue to be that I'm afraid. How many more doors (real or figurative) have to be closed in your face before you might be able to face the truth?

PASHKULI It is intended as a "placeholder" on the Internet for the search engines (eventually)

To answer to that concern (and the same one you messaged me about), this discussion is only hidden from the main forum view, it's still indexed by search engines and its forum URL is still the same. If I search for it in DuckDuckGo, the first few results point to it:

And to elaborate more on my decision to tag it with the Personal tag and effectively remove it from the main discussion list. I believe this forum is for piano enthusiasts, that's in the main description and welcome page of the forum. It's not for people who are not pianists and who think "pianos are badly designed". Bumping it with new content would naturally annoy and irritate the target crowd of a forum like ours. It will just create negativity and you've already noticed it. This is effectively trolling, although it may not be by-the-book trolling. If someone is interested, they can still find this discussion browsing through the tags explicitly. I find this more than fair enough for you.

It works!

Now I can enjoy and "be proud of my right-handedness" on such a badly, badly badly designed pianos you and all of us had to endure! I can have my right thumb on lower notes – exectly how it is on my guitar (right-handed) and play solos and melodies with my left fingers. Such a great find is this pree plugin called NoteMapper (for MIDI) by CodeFN42.
Too bad this forum is not Diversity, Equity, Inclusion of people from the non-ABCDFG+ community!
Ha. Ha. Ha.

https://www.codefn42.com/notemapper/

I've made two presens
• 61 keys
• 88 keys both split at the same notes (between E~F in the middle)

for Windows:
(presets go in
…Documents\CodeFN42\NoteMapper\Presets)

**********************************************************************************

Now… a bit more challenging question: Let's say I have two 49 key keyboards and want each on to dedicate to each hand. If I connect them on two diffrent USB ports maybe I can rout them to two diff. tracks\instances of NoteMapper. But, what if I have chained them both through a typical 5Din MIDI port (plug)? Can the MIDI data transfer protocol carry an info about the Device ID or something, so I can maybe tell the DAW to "see" them as separate devices (ID)?

Midi channels

Just ask chatgpt…

Yes, channels but buth my devices are daisy‑chained. (not MIDI thru)

Korg → Midi Out → to MIDI in (Novation)… then (Novation) MIDI Out → MIDI In (Audio Interface, 5pin DIN slot)

I can see both keyboards triggering MIDI signal in my DAWs Track.
But how to tell the Korg to output on channel 2 (for example) whilst Novation to output on channel 1?
At least that is my logic. Maybe can be done from each hardware device respectively but I've never done it and am messing up settings here (might "break" something).

Or is it possible at all. Oh, never mind. Found it!
Fabulous! Many thanks, ambrozy for the suggestion!

If you output your handware keyboard to channel 2, just copy its NoteMapper preset (uploaded above) in the UI to channel 2 in the plugin and save it (same name).
Bliss!

Of course, the keyboard (digital in this case) should have a bit different design – as such:

Left hand plays high notes. Right hand (especially thumb) plays low notes! All respective chord shapes betwen hands are the same for either hand – that is how Nature has designed our hands to be – symmetric!

Global Pitch and Mod Weels go dead center for quick access by either hand (or can be assigned to foot\pedals controller – better option). Similarly, drum pads go in that centre as well for quick access.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_yIgrkSNzE
and how am I suppose to play that?

ambrozy

This has been written on the current layout. I can not tell unless transcribed for the symmetrical one.
I can try but I am not a pianist and you will always say – it is wrong.

I have that performance in .mid (midi) file format as I was a memeber of Rousseau's YouTube channel.
Unfortunately, as manny other (99%) of such files on the internet the hands (notes performed by each hand) are not separated into different channels – iti s very difficult to "decode" them (as a non pianist) or tell what finger playes what on each hand. I can see on the video but note for note separation will take me months to do that!

The great thing about thy symmetric piano layout is that the notes of both hands will be separated… for the most part… unless the pianist wants to play close together notes at very high (left tier) or very low (right tier) section of the keyboard.

Finding properly separated hands for many baroque, classical, romantic works is tough. I have some but they are from Synthesia.
I hope you know what I am talking about.

@PASHKULI do you play any instrument? Have you recorded any music on it, a well-known piece, or just an improvisation in an established form or genre? If so, do you mind sharing it with us? I have a reason to ask that question but I can elaborate only after your answer.

PASHKULI All respective chord shapes betwen hands are the same for either hand – that is how Nature has designed our hands to be – symmetric!

To each their own, but the harmonic symmetry is already present. Symmetrical doesn’t mean identical, it means it’s mirrored. Each chord shape already has a symmetrical counterpart. Flip C Maj around the symmetry of the keys and you get A minor, etc. You can kind of cut your work in half once you start thinking in terms of symmetrical counterparts and using your hand symmetry to reinforce that as you work on training your “lizard brain”, but that seems like advantage would be lost if you’re making each hand play the same thing.

CyberGene

Do drums count? But I have no recordings of myself playing a drumkit (no smartphones back then).
Guitar I also play but have not played someonelse's music in ages… probably 18~20 years by now.
I have some recordings in a DAW using a guitar (drums are VST or samples though but "composed" by me) somewhere in the old hard drives (have to hook them up to see what is still there).
Do some of those count (it is my own music though, so it might put you off pretty quickly)?

Mindbullets

Yes, but D maj's symmetry is G min. And inversions… completely different correlation amongs notes.
So, geometrically – yes chourds have counterparts – can not be otherwise but what is the connection in this case of one overall directional layot of notes? Myabe you as a pianist can find such as a reseasch project. It might be something unexpected.

PASHKULI

PASHKULI Yes, but D maj's symmetry is G min. And inversions…

Yep, you got it. It’s what happens when you center the keys over D/G#. There’s are limited numbers of these pairs and they are all harmonic mirrors over that axis. Inversions work the same, you just need to think of it more like “butterflying” out and around the keys rather than linear ranges of octaves. Phil Best has an entire methodology around learning the keyboard map like this and it’s very simple/intuitive, IMHO.

CyberGene
do you play any instrument? Have you recorded any music on it, a well-known piece, or just an improvisation in an established form or genre?

Just for you, here (Google Drive folder) I uploaded some pieces (they are literally just pieces of ideas) of my own attemts at recording\making Music. There are two covers (and me also "singing" just for the sake of audio recording\mixing).
The quality of guitar\vocal recording is questionable. Those are 15+ older, some even 20. I used one of those portable\sticky Skype microphones you would attach to your display monitor. But overall I tried my best to mix them.
Listeners discretion is highly adviced as these music is not genre specific, rather… eclectic? Anyway… enjoy!!!

Music from the Past

PASHKULI thanks, I really enjoyed some of them, especially the one where you sing.

My question was specifically related to live performance, not sequenced compositions. Because what matters is music and musicianship, it’s what makes you hooked up and keeps the fire. I know no musician who is obsessed about symmetry and dimensions of their instrument layouts 🙂 With you I feel it’s the opposite. Unless it makes you feel good. But I rather see frustration in you from the bans and the dismissal.