My Desert Island Piano VST - VI Labs Modern D

pianow I wanted your opinions about it, thanks, looks like this new baby is everyone's darling
i haven't read a single negative impression yet, that's something isn't it?

if i may, i want your opinion about another thing as well, how do you think this modern d compares to the vsl imperial or the 280vc?
i kinda thought it's close to the vc but what do i know?
and the imperial... it is my number one to date (given the fact that i haven't tried the MD yet)
so I'll be glad to know what do you think?
so

I think the Modern D is fantastic, and in many ways may be the most authentic all-around grand piano VST, but I wouldn't say it in any way diminishes my enthusiasm for the VSL instruments, particularly the Imperial. In fact, I think they actually compliment each other quite well and represent 2 different but equally valid approaches.

The VSL recordings are more polished and have a depth of tone that you can feel in your bones - like playing an exquisitely produced high-end studio recording. In that sense, they may provide more of an idealized perspective vs. one that is entirely realistic, but it certainly is very satisfying. And they certainly capture the unique tone of each piano in a way that makes each one feel like a living, breathing instrument.

Modern U provides a bit more of a raw and realistic sound perspective, closer to what it's like to actually have a piano in front of you in a small studio. Not quite as polished and perfect as VSL, but just as satisfying. And the playability is a notch or two better than VSL - it responds exactly like you would expect, has superior pedaling, and the inclusion of real una corda samples is a big advantage over the VSL Synchron series. The 5 close mic perspectives allow just the right amount of flexibility without including a bunch of superfluous mid and surround-level mic positions as in the VSL series. And at $250 for the whole package, it certainly represents a better value.

I'm glad to have both and see myself playing both regularly going forward. But if I was going to recommend one single instrument for a pianist (as opposed to a sound producer), it would have to be the Modern D. It just has all the elements in place.

Maybe this will inspire VSL to keep improving their products now that a new reference level has been reached. Either way, I really hope VI Labs keeps pushing forward and adds further models down the line. I can only imagine how amazing it would be if they did their own version of Bosendorfer Imperial or Yamaha CFX. 🤯

jdg78

I appreciate your time and effort buddy, i got my answer so thanks

the idea of having a vilabs imperial or cfx is just nuts (even though i think they might release a cfx one day, that's what i expect them to do really)

the only synchron piano that i LOVE playing and making music with is the imperial, it sounds incredible and plays even better, the only downsides for me are :
1 in some modern (huh) mixes it doesn't sound as punchy and full as it should
2 sometimes when you press the sus pedal the lower velocities get a lot louder then what i think is realistic

i hear non of that in modern d demos so hell yea
the recordings sound so punchy and alive especially for more modern arrangements, and the sustain pedal doesn't have separate samples (there are only resonance samples with the pedal down) so the dynamic quality of the instrument doesn't change when you press the pedal (not ro mention that there's a una corda pedal so we can get even softer then the lowest sustain samples)

but anyway I don't wanna give up on vsl, especially their imperial,

as you said i hope they'd up their game to date,
i think now's the best time to do so, they have lossless compression now and the Vienna imperial is almost discontinued
so yea, do it vsl

another question (if i may)
do you feel connected to the modern d? the worst nightmare with any sampled/modeled/virtualized piano for me is when i don't feel connected to them
like the vsl steinway (i can never feel the energy of the piano around me, it's just a sound that is coming towards my ears)

pianow I've given up on VSL after the Steinway… And they are more expensive than VI Labs pianos, too… So yeah.

For me, I really feel connected, that is, once I have a good curve ready. That's how I was able to make the demos.

pianow another question (if i may)
do you feel connected to the modern d?

Yes, absolutely. I feel like I can express myself entirely on it - there's little to no barrier between what my brain and fingers tell it to do and how it responds back to me.

And I know what you mean about the Synchron Steinway - there is something a little bit cold and impersonal about it. I don't get that feeling at all with the Modern D.

jdg78 a human that use spirio lol 🙂 the velocity is incredible fine🙂

David Lai I've given up on VSL after the Steinway

i fully respect your opinion, but the concert d is their worst piano, it's not fair to give up on them because of that piano
although i can fully understand you, the concert d isn't a good experience at all, like @jdg78 said, there's something impersonal about it, other synchrons are way better, especially the three bosendorfers

David Lai For me, I really feel connected, that is, once I have a good curve ready. That's how I was able to make the demos.

excellent, thanks for the reply davy

jdg78
yea there's something odd going on with the recordings of the concert d, i remember a thread in vi control, it was about "what is the best synchron" and a user (re peat) said that the concert d is somewhat poorly sampled, idk if that's true but i felt like he's the only one who hears what i hear in the samples, like you can bring the piano closer, closer and closer
from far, reverberant, and distant to unrealisfically close, muddy and unclear but never intimate and calming

I'm kinda sure the modern d doesn't have those qualities to it, cause the Same guy in the vi control said it's incredible and probably the finest sampled piano (steinway)

anyway thanks for the help, you've been incredibly helpful in my vi journey, like david lai🤍

jdg78

some engineers and audio pros say that it has a big impact on the final results, how a piano actually sounds when a human play it versus how it sounds with a robotic finger hit its keys,
I'm with them on this one actually

about consistency, i think it's more about calibration then what hitting the keys,
imagine you've sampled and scripted you virtual piano
so you find a very accurate midi output (an accurate keyboard) and put it next to the piano itself
then you start playing lots of different pieces on both and at rhe Same time you try to make the virtual one response closer to the actual thing
until there's next to no difference, that's how i would do it of course (idk what vi labs has done but I'm sure they calibrated it somehow)

jdg78 same feeling here 🙂

OlivierW yes it's the fist VST/AU that don't need velocity fix.

jdg78 I don't find much need to adjust the velocity curve settings as it plays very well right out of the box on my Numa X GT.

This is interesting. My impressions are that the N1X and the Numa X GT are quite different in velocity respons especially regarding how easy/hard it is to reach the highest velocity values, but I might be wrong. Maybe @David B or @CyberGene could fill in on that as you own/have owned both pianos? Maybe a well made product as the modern D has a greater tolerance and feels natural on a greater variety of midi keyboard with different midi responses than other pianos?

jdg78 To be honest, I'm not sure what advantage this would bring since the only thing a human could introduce is greater inconsistency

I agree. I'm thinking using built in player systems such as Disklavier or Spirio should be optimal to reach consistent velocity response in a sampling process.

johanibraaten This is interesting. My impressions are that the N1X and the Numa X GT are quite different in velocity respons especially regarding how easy/hard it is to reach the highest velocity values, but I might be wrong.

To be fair, when I first got the Numa X GT, I spent quite a bit of time adjusting the touch response to fit my own personal preferences. One of the big advantages of this model is that it's possible to make precise adjustments to the touch sensitivity and midi output of each individual key so that you can effectively regulate the entire keyboard however you'd like.

Since doing this, I find that I don't need to adjust the velocity response of individual off-board instruments quite as much as I used to, though some still require a bit of additional intervention.

Ah I see. Of course, that seems like a logical explanation. I’m used to my my N1 that doesn’t seem to change the midi output when the internal touch sensitivity is changed so I always have to adjust in the external software.

johanibraaten There's always this balancing act, it looks like -- either modify the keyboard, or adjust the software. For me, I prefer adjusting from the hardware part as not all software UI is natively accessible.

Do we have already any convention in which are the best settings (on headphones at least)? Like Modern U Thread

I am enjoying too much this library for the past days, can't go back to any other, feels so good, but wondering which settings are using everybody

Infinito

Infinito I keep going back between the close + player, side + player, side + room, reverb on / off, ETC. I haven't settled on anything. All to me are good.

this afternoon, after i got free from work i went back to the old native instruments maverick
and oddly enough i enjoyed it more then ever after dialing it a bit
i asked myself how close the modern d can be (given the fact that they're two completely different pianos, one is modern other is vintage, one is a semi concert grand, other's a 9 foot one, but anyway... what do you guys think about similarities?
the grandeur and maverick are still some of the best pianos around imo

pianow I love the grandeur and how it was prepared and sampled. But The maverick has some tuning issues. However, since it's a vintage, restored instrument, we can be gentle about it.

My main concern, though, is still that both instruments do not contain una corda samples, this gives Modern D the edge of being more fully featured. And with more velocity layers and detail, the Modern D also has a better response.

David Lai
of course, i was thinking about the sound of these instruments actually
how the grandeur and maverick compare to the modern d sound wise?

i know about the feature set

btw the grandeur was my first piano that has sampled resonances, i used to adore this thing, i still love it of course but it was a romantic relationship back in the day
it sounds GOOD
and one of the reasons i love vsl imperial is that it has a similar tone and the recording techniques are very close in my opinion
but what about the MD
how close is it?

pianow Well, I'm a bit limited in time, but I'll let a blind comparison help me speak.

Someone on VI Control posted the following demo. They tried matching the response curves between the 7 libraries. They recorded a midi and copied it 7 times and pasted with different piano VIs. Have fun listening

vst-steinway-comparisons.mp3

Featured libraries:

Ivory II American D

Session Keys Grand S

NI The Grandeur

VI Labs True Keys American

Pianoteq 8 NY Steinway D

IK-M Pianoverse NY Grand S274

Cinesamples Piano in Blue

The tone similarities are ordered. Happy listening!

Note, this was posted by someone else, not my playing.