OlivierW This is very close to my current settings as well, although I substitute the close mic for the hammer and use the "Pink Concert Room" reverb, which has a funny name (why is it Pink?) but sounds very warm and inviting to me.
Like you, I don't find much need to adjust the velocity curve settings as it plays very well right out of the box on my Numa X GT.
jdg78 Wow, congratulations! I didn't know you also got it. Really cool!!!
jdg78 i will try to replace hammer mic, but it's strange : velocity is so perfect, i'm sure this Steinway have a spirio system. they don't tell use but sure they have used a spirio system to choose velocity, incredible. (Spirio much better than an external robot). i'm sure is so perfect
i don't think so, of course most newer made steinways have spirio built-in but i don't think they've used it for sampling here
I think it's the art of a pianist
the dynamics are very true and pianistic, it's like they calibrated it after the sampling with the pianist, i think they've played a lot of pieces both on the actual piano and the virtualized one so that they can make them both incredibly similar in teams of the response, that's what i think of course and what i would do, i don't know what they did behind the scenes
who cares anyway, we have the best sampled grand FINALLY,
I'm excited for their next piano already (even though that's a dream until 2027 at least😂)
I wanted your opinions about it, thanks, looks like this new baby is everyone's darling
i haven't read a single negative impression yet, that's something isn't it?
if i may, i want your opinion about another thing as well, how do you think this modern d compares to the vsl imperial or the 280vc?
i kinda thought it's close to the vc but what do i know?
and the imperial... it is my number one to date (given the fact that i haven't tried the MD yet)
so I'll be glad to know what do you think?
so
OlivierW they don't tell use but sure they have used a spirio system to choose velocity, incredible. (Spirio much better than an external robot).
I'm pretty sure they mentioned in their walkthrough video that they used an actual human to sample the various velocities as opposed to a mechanical system.
To be honest, I'm not sure what advantage this would bring since the only thing a human could introduce is greater inconsistency, but regardless of the method used, the result is very even and responsive.
David Lai Wow, congratulations! I didn't know you also got it. Really cool!!!
LOL, I got it the first day it was released and already wrote my impressions on this very thread, but that I guess that seems like a long time ago already. 😆
pianow I wanted your opinions about it, thanks, looks like this new baby is everyone's darling
i haven't read a single negative impression yet, that's something isn't it?if i may, i want your opinion about another thing as well, how do you think this modern d compares to the vsl imperial or the 280vc?
i kinda thought it's close to the vc but what do i know?
and the imperial... it is my number one to date (given the fact that i haven't tried the MD yet)
so I'll be glad to know what do you think?
so
I think the Modern D is fantastic, and in many ways may be the most authentic all-around grand piano VST, but I wouldn't say it in any way diminishes my enthusiasm for the VSL instruments, particularly the Imperial. In fact, I think they actually compliment each other quite well and represent 2 different but equally valid approaches.
The VSL recordings are more polished and have a depth of tone that you can feel in your bones - like playing an exquisitely produced high-end studio recording. In that sense, they may provide more of an idealized perspective vs. one that is entirely realistic, but it certainly is very satisfying. And they certainly capture the unique tone of each piano in a way that makes each one feel like a living, breathing instrument.
Modern U provides a bit more of a raw and realistic sound perspective, closer to what it's like to actually have a piano in front of you in a small studio. Not quite as polished and perfect as VSL, but just as satisfying. And the playability is a notch or two better than VSL - it responds exactly like you would expect, has superior pedaling, and the inclusion of real una corda samples is a big advantage over the VSL Synchron series. The 5 close mic perspectives allow just the right amount of flexibility without including a bunch of superfluous mid and surround-level mic positions as in the VSL series. And at $250 for the whole package, it certainly represents a better value.
I'm glad to have both and see myself playing both regularly going forward. But if I was going to recommend one single instrument for a pianist (as opposed to a sound producer), it would have to be the Modern D. It just has all the elements in place.
Maybe this will inspire VSL to keep improving their products now that a new reference level has been reached. Either way, I really hope VI Labs keeps pushing forward and adds further models down the line. I can only imagine how amazing it would be if they did their own version of Bosendorfer Imperial or Yamaha CFX. 🤯
I appreciate your time and effort buddy, i got my answer so thanks
the idea of having a vilabs imperial or cfx is just nuts (even though i think they might release a cfx one day, that's what i expect them to do really)
the only synchron piano that i LOVE playing and making music with is the imperial, it sounds incredible and plays even better, the only downsides for me are :
1 in some modern (huh) mixes it doesn't sound as punchy and full as it should
2 sometimes when you press the sus pedal the lower velocities get a lot louder then what i think is realistic
i hear non of that in modern d demos so hell yea
the recordings sound so punchy and alive especially for more modern arrangements, and the sustain pedal doesn't have separate samples (there are only resonance samples with the pedal down) so the dynamic quality of the instrument doesn't change when you press the pedal (not ro mention that there's a una corda pedal so we can get even softer then the lowest sustain samples)
but anyway I don't wanna give up on vsl, especially their imperial,
as you said i hope they'd up their game to date,
i think now's the best time to do so, they have lossless compression now and the Vienna imperial is almost discontinued
so yea, do it vsl
another question (if i may)
do you feel connected to the modern d? the worst nightmare with any sampled/modeled/virtualized piano for me is when i don't feel connected to them
like the vsl steinway (i can never feel the energy of the piano around me, it's just a sound that is coming towards my ears)
pianow I've given up on VSL after the Steinway… And they are more expensive than VI Labs pianos, too… So yeah.
For me, I really feel connected, that is, once I have a good curve ready. That's how I was able to make the demos.
pianow another question (if i may)
do you feel connected to the modern d?
Yes, absolutely. I feel like I can express myself entirely on it - there's little to no barrier between what my brain and fingers tell it to do and how it responds back to me.
And I know what you mean about the Synchron Steinway - there is something a little bit cold and impersonal about it. I don't get that feeling at all with the Modern D.
jdg78 a human that use spirio lol 🙂 the velocity is incredible fine🙂
David Lai I've given up on VSL after the Steinway
i fully respect your opinion, but the concert d is their worst piano, it's not fair to give up on them because of that piano
although i can fully understand you, the concert d isn't a good experience at all, like @jdg78 said, there's something impersonal about it, other synchrons are way better, especially the three bosendorfers
David Lai For me, I really feel connected, that is, once I have a good curve ready. That's how I was able to make the demos.
excellent, thanks for the reply davy
jdg78
yea there's something odd going on with the recordings of the concert d, i remember a thread in vi control, it was about "what is the best synchron" and a user (re peat) said that the concert d is somewhat poorly sampled, idk if that's true but i felt like he's the only one who hears what i hear in the samples, like you can bring the piano closer, closer and closer
from far, reverberant, and distant to unrealisfically close, muddy and unclear but never intimate and calming
I'm kinda sure the modern d doesn't have those qualities to it, cause the Same guy in the vi control said it's incredible and probably the finest sampled piano (steinway)
anyway thanks for the help, you've been incredibly helpful in my vi journey, like david lai🤍
some engineers and audio pros say that it has a big impact on the final results, how a piano actually sounds when a human play it versus how it sounds with a robotic finger hit its keys,
I'm with them on this one actually
about consistency, i think it's more about calibration then what hitting the keys,
imagine you've sampled and scripted you virtual piano
so you find a very accurate midi output (an accurate keyboard) and put it next to the piano itself
then you start playing lots of different pieces on both and at rhe Same time you try to make the virtual one response closer to the actual thing
until there's next to no difference, that's how i would do it of course (idk what vi labs has done but I'm sure they calibrated it somehow)
jdg78 same feeling here 🙂
This is interesting. My impressions are that the N1X and the Numa X GT are quite different in velocity respons especially regarding how easy/hard it is to reach the highest velocity values, but I might be wrong. Maybe @David B or @CyberGene could fill in on that as you own/have owned both pianos? Maybe a well made product as the modern D has a greater tolerance and feels natural on a greater variety of midi keyboard with different midi responses than other pianos?
jdg78 To be honest, I'm not sure what advantage this would bring since the only thing a human could introduce is greater inconsistency
I agree. I'm thinking using built in player systems such as Disklavier or Spirio should be optimal to reach consistent velocity response in a sampling process.
johanibraaten This is interesting. My impressions are that the N1X and the Numa X GT are quite different in velocity respons especially regarding how easy/hard it is to reach the highest velocity values, but I might be wrong.
To be fair, when I first got the Numa X GT, I spent quite a bit of time adjusting the touch response to fit my own personal preferences. One of the big advantages of this model is that it's possible to make precise adjustments to the touch sensitivity and midi output of each individual key so that you can effectively regulate the entire keyboard however you'd like.
Since doing this, I find that I don't need to adjust the velocity response of individual off-board instruments quite as much as I used to, though some still require a bit of additional intervention.
Ah I see. Of course, that seems like a logical explanation. I’m used to my my N1 that doesn’t seem to change the midi output when the internal touch sensitivity is changed so I always have to adjust in the external software.
johanibraaten There's always this balancing act, it looks like -- either modify the keyboard, or adjust the software. For me, I prefer adjusting from the hardware part as not all software UI is natively accessible.