pianoteq sympathetic resonances

dore_m Do you know what side chaining is?

exactly the same as having a side-girl,

dore_m does your VSL know you're having an affair with pianoteq on the side ? 🤓

dore_m I did the silent key trick, and I got the correct harmonics and there was no MIDI data going to PTQ at all.

How can ptq detect fundamental harmonics of a silent note? There is no such thing as "silent frequencies"... Some midi information is shared for sure.

vagfilm How can ptq detect fundamental harmonics of a silent note? There is no such thing as "silent frequencies"... Some midi information is shared for sure.

I confuse myself. possibly I was using a input audio (I used Maverick) as an input, and it's not purely silent. I'll have to check again. You're right - that would be impossible without detecting the fundamental frequency of the silent note.

I've done a full 360 on this one.

1. Sidechaining does not include MIDI data, only audio data
2. Using PTQ via sidechaining does not yield selective open string resonance (Pedal up)
3. Triggering PTQ using MIDI DOES yield selective open string resonance (pedal up)
4. Selective open string resonance absolutely needs MIDI data to detect the open string, especially when there is a "silent key".

I made a dumb mistake in my test - I used NI Maverick as my test subject, and it supports selective open string resonance by default, so the reso that I heard was coming from Maverick and not PTQ. PTQ indeed can only support body resonance, aka pedal down, while sidechaining. If you want selective open string resonance, you MUST send MIDI to it - or in a DAW, you must activate the track and actively send MIDI to it (which is not side chaining).

OlivierW Glad you enjoy it with VSL , which I didn't test as I don't have it . Only had a test version that expired. Cheers and happy playing with the D-274 !

dore_m

Yuu are right.

But what is the problem ? Side Chain AUDIO + rules via MIDI ?

It works like a charm in a daw ( i've full SSR, thanks midi, and i set the Pianoteq midi velocity at 0 to 0 (i've the SSR midi rules without the main PTQ sound, and it works very nice).

I've compared with my Real Grand Piano. Very very fine and real.

Regards,

Olivier

vagfilm

Because silent note in Pianoteq (key down / undampered key ) send midi velocity value at 0 with Note on. (you can set your own MIDI value, 0, 1 ,2 ….)

So it's work, and it's all, behave like my real Schimmel or Steinway… like YAMAHA VRM. (and better than VRM, in VRM overtones decay is to fast)

Regards,

Olivier

A better explaination here

OlivierW Yuu are right.

But what is the problem ? Side Chain AUDIO + rules via MIDI ?

It works like a charm in a daw ( i've full SSR, thanks midi, and i set the Pianoteq midi velocity at 0 to 0 (i've the SSR midi rules without the main PTQ sound, and it works very nice).

I've compared with my Real Grand Piano. Very very fine and real.

It's not a problem, I just think we have a misunderstanding and differing viewpoints. Probably the thing that is important to you is that people understand how good VSL + PTQ resonance is, and you're probably right - its very nice. But the thing that is important to me is that understand how it works, because I'm a guy that actually makes sample libraries.

When you wrote that I was wrong, I needed proof, then went to into a spiral of misinterpreting how PTQ actually works. Thanks to @vagfilm , I came back to my senses and still don't see any proof that my technical analysis was wrong in the first place. You might find the number of engineers and scientists on this forum take the technical aspects of these libraries pretty seriously - at least I do.

And yes, you are correct, using PTQ and VSL together (but directly without side chaining) can be a great combination. In my opinion, PTQ's sidechaining feature is a half-solution - you do need to trigger via midi, which means creating a parallel track to get the entire effect and means that the sidechaining isn't even necessary in the first place.

OlivierW But what is the problem ? Side Chain AUDIO + rules via MIDI ?

Same thing here: absolutely no problem... Sharing midi data between instruments is the correct and only complete way to add complex SR to a VST that lacks it... As far as I remember, that idea was already floated a long time ago in the PTQ forums, and Modartt finally acted upon it.

To some extent, what @dore_m put into his SR Kontakt scripts is basically the same approach (using midi alone to know the status of the keys and creating "universal" SR that is overlayed on the samples).

So, I was not criticizing PTQ or doubting the effectiveness of the approach. I was simply clarifying that in order to have SR generated by undampened strings (silent keys) some midi information is needed: PTQ cannot guess the sound of silence.

vagfilm we are agree 🙂

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ce7361osat8wno7/SET-PTQ-FOR_SSR.png?dl=1