Yamaha CP88 Review

CyberGene · 2022-05-16T13:04:02+00:00

I received the Yamaha CP88 today. This will be a very brief initial review that I may update when I use it for more time. General It is a very solid instrument with all metal panels. Not very heavy for such a robust stage piano at 18kg. Slightly better than those 22kg digital pianos. It's also good-looking, kind of vintage due to rocker switches, etc. I like that they put the pitch and modulation sticks above the keyboard and not to the left as on some other stage pianos, thus it's not too wide. Interface It's very easy to use, similar to a Nord interface but everybody already knows that. Keyboard It has NW-GH3 action. I'm not sure what exactly that means since the name is a mix between NWX (as in P515) and GH3 (as in some of their Clavinovas). The keys feel nice and heavy. I've been going back and forth between it and my Yamaha AvantGrand N1X and the CP88 feels slightly heavier and just a bit more pushing against your fingers compared to the real grand piano action. But difference is not huge and I felt comfortable with that transition. It's not a tiring action to play, nor is annoying in any particular way. What is more, it doesn't have artificial escapement simulation which is something I love! It's graded though and has wooden sides (cores?). The touch response with the piano sounds is very good. I returned a YC73 (with BHS action) before getting the CP88 and I think the BHS action was less heavy and easier to play but also more pushing towards your fingers and the BHS also had some plastic feel to it whereas here I feel more of "pushing some real hammer" beneath my fingers. That is all subjective but I can say the NW-GH3 action is definitely a superior action compared to the BHS and is probably among the best digital piano actions I've tried. The white keys have some fake ivory surface to minimize friction. I'm not a huge fan of those. But my skin is very dry usually. Maybe people who sweat a lot will find it good. The black keys have artificially roughened texture and I find this pretty silly. All at all, the smooth white acrylic and (whatever it's covered with) black surface of my N1X feels more refined and higher quality than this fakery. But it's not a criticism. Maybe some people love those things. Sounds This is a professional stage piano for gigging musicians, not acoustic piano replacement (or home piano), so take that in mind All sounds are really sweet and nice. I first went through all the factory programs which include various acoustic pianos, electric pianos, as well as various layers with pads, organs, synths, etc. and there wasn't a single one that made me think "this is cheap, why did they put it?". I'm usually very critical about layered pianos with pads and strings but I guess the quality of the samples and effects is pretty high here because none was annoying, they are very subtle and varied and many of them reminded me of sounds I've heard on Lyle Mays records. It's definitely been programmed by real musicians who use these programs rather than engineers. As of firmware 1.5 there are now 6-7 full different acoustic piano samples with the CFX naturally being my favorite, I'm used to that sound already. They recently introduced a Hamburg (presumably Steinway) which is also very nice. There is a "Nashville" sample which sounds realistically imperfect and thus suitable for non-classical piano work. When I say "imperfect" I don't mean honky-tonk, rather a piano that is more real life, like a good workhorse (non-concert size) grand piano that you would find in a studio. And it's not an exaggerated piano sound that is artificially brightened or something like that. It's just a nice studio grand piano sound (I think Nashville is the studio where that piano was sampled) that can find great usage on stage and in more pop/jazz oriented context. There are also a few upright pianos and the recently added felt piano in 1.5 is absolutely fantastic! Especially combined with the excellent reverb and compressor it's a nice sound for modern cinematic/pop stuff. There are so many Rhodes samples and all of them are excellent (I'm starting to repeat myself)... The effects and the amp simulation are too. Enough said. The pads and strings are all very nice. Jazz organs are OK I think, there's nice rotary simulation. Maybe not for purists but usable. All the effects sound great. The reverb is a high quality one IMO. Not to VST standards but better than the average for professional stage pianos. And light years ahead of the usual reverb in home digital pianos. Features It has a USB interface, so I can easily add Moog Model D (and other iOS synths) to it through a single USB cable to my iPhone (for both MIDI and digital audio). It also has a very good master controller functionality with 4 external zones with detailed settings (including program change), so one can prepare live sets that include external synths. Another "feature" is Yamaha have IdeaScale where people can suggest features for the CP/YC (and other instruments) and they listen to the customers and implement some ideas, constantly improving the usability, adding samples and features. Seems those instruments were created as platforms that can be constantly updated and enriched and that is rather surprising when you consider it's Yamaha who are the last company you could expect that from! Cons It would be great if there was VRM. There's only damper resonance effect which is rather subtle but as I said it's a professional stage piano for gigging and not for home situations. I returned the YC73 because one of the encoders didn't have resistance when turned (leaked oil according to Yamaha service center). Well, I also have a few of these here 😕 I'm already tired of returning instruments to Thomann (with no piano available for weeks) and I will consider this a small issue and will live with it after all. I feel dumb now. Seems like the no-resistance encoders are intentional and I returned a perfectly working YC73. But well, it's a blessing in disguise since I like the CP88 more than the YC73 😀

CyberGene

Drew-r In the photo, what is the mini-keyboard above the CP88 (with brown wooden cheeks)

It's an ASM Hydrasynth (with custom-made wooden cheeks by an Italian member of the Hydrasynth Facebook Group). It's my favorite synth, very easy to program but also with very powerful architecture and supporting polyphonic aftertouch, i.e. when you play a chord and hold it, you can accentuate separate notes by pressing more the corresponding key with your finger. That is a very rare feature, most keyboards support only channel aftertouch which means that if you push a key, it won't know which key you're pushing and will activate aftertouch for all the currently held notes.

Drew-r Can you or do you use either keyboard to play the other via midi, or do you just like to have the mini right there to play - separate - from the CP88?

I only connect the audio output from the Hydrasynth to the audio input of the Yamaha, so that I can listen to both at the same time from my headphones connected to the Yamaha but otherwise I play them separately. I prefer that way, the hammer action is for pianos, the synth is for synth stuff 🙂

CyberGene

HZPiano I'd say that is unacceptable in a € 2.159 instrument. Even more so if this is the second one you find these defects in.

It is now confirmed this is a feature, not a bug and is intentional 🤦🏻‍♂️ Very silly on my side to return the YC73 thinking it was defective while it was perfectly OK but anyway, I like the CP88 more 😀

CyberGene

Here’s some random noodling, some Rhodes + Hydrasynth first, then in the middle I show some of the piano samples, then I end with the felt piano and a lot of reverb.

Pete14

Can I have some ‘random noodling’ to go?😉

It’s definitely worth it, you guys, this obsession of ours, and if only more people knew this, they’d spend less time small-talking and more time playing an instrument.

I go to sleep thinking piano; I wake up thinking piano, and there is no better obsession that I can think of on this planet.

CyberGene

Pete14 Thank you, Pete! And yes, I go to bed with the piano, not just because I always think of pianos but because if you look close at the video above, you'd realize that's actually a bed I'm sitting at and my pillow is also visible there 🤣 My wife is usually on my right (well, when I'm not snoring, that is) and my CP88 is now on my left...

Frédéric L

Before the NWX (and its escapement emulation), there was the NW (CLP470 and CLP480). With its name, the NW-GH3 could be closer to the NW than to the NWX (or even identical).

CyberGene

I think it’s a GH3 action (because it has triple sensors) but with wooden cores. I think the NW actions were similar to Kawai if I’m not mistaken: with long wooden key sticks. And this one is a folded action, possibly close to GH3 action, hence the name. The NWX is a more advanced action at least from my memories with the P515.

Pete14

CyberGene I go to bed with the piano, not just because I always think of pianos but because if you look close at the video above, you'd realize that's actually a bed I'm sitting at and my pillow is also visible there 🤣

Honestly, I was wondering if that was a bed you were sitting on, but I didn’t feel comfortable asking you.😁

So yes, you literally go to bed playing the piano, and it would be interesting to know how your bed compares to an overpriced Jansen bench.😉

CyberGene

Pete14 The bed is too low and the stand is already at its lowest possible position but I'm still too low and uncomfortable. I'm wondering how Glenn Gould and Evgeni Bozhanov manage to play that low... I use some pillows to get higher.

Hopefully I will find a space soon where I can make my own small studio and a home office... The bedroom is at its limits right now 😢

Pete14

I love Gould, but I’ve come to believe the whole sitting extremely low and “I only play on that chair” was simply Gould being Gould.

He did love “shocking/pissing off” the establishment, but sometimes he went a bit too far, or should I say too low?

I wonder if some of his excesses (including over-medicating) eventually caught up with him. I’ve heard that he developed several “hand-issues” towards the end of his life.

P.S.

Good luck with building your studio/office/man-cave.😉

David B

CyberGene Here’s some random noodling, some Rhodes + Hydrasynth first, then in the middle I show some of the piano samples, then I end with the felt piano and a lot of reverb.

Awesome!

Great music to go with a psilocybin treatment. 😀

Seriously though, I wish I could just sit down and create music like that. Thanks for sharing.

God Bless,
David

Paul J

Great review and loving that spacey vibe CG, just what I need to help me get to sleep now………

Frédéric L

The NWX action from the P515 is here :

It is quite close to the GH3X excepted the wooden core. The NW is only a NWX without escapement simulator.

RIP

Frédéric L The NWX action from the P515 is here :

Where did you find that picture? I love that Kawai is very clear about their actions, whereas Yamaha is extremely secretive and confusing wrt to what-is-what

Frédéric L It is quite close to the GH3X excepted the wooden core. The NW is only a NWX without escapement simulator.

Ditto. Where did you get that information? Also, does anybody know what the difference is between the similarly named Balanced Hammer Standard, Balanced Hammer Effect and how do they compare with Graded Hammer, Graded Hammer Standard, Graded Hammer Effect and Graded Hammer 3? I know about https://usa.yamaha.com/support/faq/keyboards/6575.html but that does not say basically anything, other than "the GHS is the cheaper, the rest are different and all premium, if you buy from us you won't be dissatisfied"

CyberGene

Yamaha have used the GH moniker for ages while it has been often mentioned that these actions went through various revisions and improvements.

It’s Yamaha after all.

HZPiano

RIP

Indeed the Yamaha information is utterly hazy and therefore (to me) frustrating.

Over these past weeks, this afternoon included, I tried all CLP-7xx actions and the P-515 action and GHS (that latter one not really a test because I knew it already). Last week I somewhat thought I liked the action in the 745, however, this afternoon I didn't at all. So, no digital Yamaha action for me (not counting the hybrids).

This afternoon I played a Yamaha C7X (factory new instrument) and… I liked the action, the control and the instrument a lot 😇. Very nicely balanced in all sorts of aspects and very playable. Rather different from the C7.

Also played the 1892 Blüthner 180 again… and that is and stays top-level candy 🧁. Men oh men is that a special instrument. Also highly playable even though it requires a different approach from, say, that C7X.

Cheers and happy playing,

HaZy

Frédéric L

I think I have get a wrong illustration from a P515 article, sorry.

However, https://www.pianodreamers.com/yamaha-p515-review/ Has a more trustworthy photo I have already seen elsewhere. The rods under the Yamaha keyboard is typical of their actions.

CyberGene

It's still unclear what the difference between NWX and GH3 is, except for the wood in the NWX. Are they mechanically the same, like having the same type of hammer weight, size, position, movement, sensor actuation, etc.?

And then, where does NW-GH3 sit? 😀

I will have to make another visit to our local Yamaha store, now that I have fresh impression of the NW-GH3 in my CP88 and compare it against the NWX in P515. If my finger memory serves me well, I think the NWX in the P515 has some initial friction in addition to the weight inertia from the hammers. If that's true, they emulated the friction in real piano actions although I don't find any perceptual friction in my N1X. The NW-GH3 on the other hand has no initial friction.

I had a very curious experience this morning when I woke up and (as I said the piano is now next to me in our bedroom 🤦🏻‍♂️) reached for it to play the keys while the piano was turned off. My initial impression was: hell, that is too heavy and unnatural, why did I purchase it 😀 Then I switched it on and started playing and it was totally different! The keys and their inertia felt exactly right and I wouldn't say they were unnecessary heavy at all! I believe the key to sound connection is very important for how a keyboard ultimately feels. Yamaha really nailed the touch response. As a side note, I always had this problem with all the Kawai digital pianos I owned: their keyboards felt great when turned off, but once I started playing, it was always an odd experience with unnatural touch response, jumping velocities, exaggerated response, way too easy to produce loud volume which combined with the low key weighting resulted in a rather underwhelming experience. On the other hand, the Yamaha pianos have always had a very good key to sound connection and although people would describe the keys almost unequivocally as "heavy", the final piano experience is a very satisfying one.

All that being said, the CP88 is no match against the N1X. The N1X is just so much better!

vagfilm

Frédéric L
I think the previous one was a Roland action...

Pete14

CyberGene My initial impression was: hell, that is too heavy and unnatural, why did I purchase it 😀 Then I switched it on and started playing and it was totally different! The keys and their inertia felt exactly right and I wouldn't say they were unnecessary heavy at all! I believe the key to sound connection is very important for how a keyboard ultimately feels. Yamaha really nailed the touch response….

This!