VSL Bosendorfer 280VC (my dearest🤍)

pianow · 2024-09-11T16:20:54+00:00

all of you people know that i adore this piano, i never shut up about it😁😁 but today I'm gonna tell you WHY i love it so much, starting with the pros: it is truly 3 dimensional, the attack is not a simple volume pick, you can hear (and even feel it with your body when playing with studio monitors) that the attack rings through the soundboard and not just that, it does that in the most realistic and convincing way, it's beautiful. i saw some people comparing the highs of the 280vc to the pianoteq💀 it's not fair to this (280) piano, dare i say it has the best highs among all virtual pianots, it's as real as it gets. the thing that sells it for me is how full it sounds, i always start playing a new piano by playing a Cmaj chord with medium pressure, with the most virtual pianos, it sounds empty and bodyless, even one of my favourites (vsl lmperial) does this to a certain point although it's so much better then most pianos but not the 280vc, the moment i played that chord on the 280vc i was like : 🤯🤯🤯 it was unbelievably full and warm. the playability: next generation, you heard that right, it plays like a Lamborghini, better then all virtual pianos even some of the vsl own pianos (after the 280vc, vsl is doing the same with their newer pianos, the f308 and f212 also have most of these qualities, it's just that I don't really like the tone of the faziolis but I'm keeping an eye out for newer Pianos with the same quality from them) another pro is how this thing handles a mix or an arrangement, you can put it in any mix and it doesn't desolve like the d274, it doesn't get drowned like the cfx, and it doesn't get unrealistically forward like the f308, it stays where you want it to.. but sometimes it offers too much body for the song and you might wanna cut some low frequencies out to be able to put it where you want. the cons (yeah there's some flaws and this is a honest review so I'm pointing those out as well😁) first, the Highest velocities are somewhat unpleasant to my ears, so bright and brutal (sometimes you may need them but i don't) i like the fff range of the imperial so much better the imperial fortissimos unfold so beautifully and it's to be expected considering how big the stage A is, it lets the piano breathe so heavily, the 280vc on the other hand is much narrower in that range, the character of the tone doesn't open up like the imperial, that's not a flaw of course, that's how these pianos are recorded. the other con (this is really bothering me) is the E3 and E#3 those notes have so much nasality to them, to the point that they can ruin a chord when they're in it, I'm exaggerating of course but they're not pleasant at all, i wish vsl would fix them third flaw, it doesn't let me buy more pianos, it's like whatever I'm gonna buy after this gorgeous piano will be a downgrade, i feel trapped😭 i like how the imperial sounds but the 280vc is better in lots of ways, i can convince myself thay i need another piano (untill vsl release another beauty like this one and evdn better) another point (it's not a flaw or a pro or anything but a personal experience) i feel like most effects work better on the 280vc (due to its full and rounded sound) then the stage a pianos and the uprights (and i don't like how the effects work with the bluthner or fhe New f212 so basically i think it only works this fine with fhe 280) i was playing with unrealistic reverbs and delays (blackhole and raum and others) and none of the vsl offerings sounded as good as the 280, it was dreamy, i loved it so all in all, in today's market I'd only recommend two virtual pianos seriously, for production and studio use, and even playing : vsl 280vc for playing everything and some studio work : vsl imperial

pianow

David Lai Even they say that some kind of recording was used to create the model. So it's not totally math, there are audio samples (recordings) involved.

that's how even pianoteq works, modelling can't do shit without having some high quality samples to begin with,

but this guy's from the future, where there's no sample, not even real instruments, only modeles ones💀 i died at this very moment

pianow

QuasiUnaFantasia Sampled, modelled, acoustic

nope, the actual question is sampled or modeled, no-one can bring acoustic to this

it's like bringing a f35 to a cycling club

and between samples and models, you know who's the winner, everytime😉

Pete14

pianow and between samples and models, you know who's the winner, everytime

Of course, we know who the winner is, but we don’t like bragging about it; because that would be rude!

Regarding “the pictures,” I still maintain that “Frankenstein” best represents samples: a thing brought back from the dead by using random body parts disposed and marked as “for experimentation only; please do not use to make a monster.”

Still, the crazy scientist ignored the advice and did it anyway: “It’s alive,” only it isn’t!

https://youtu.be/QuoKNZjr8_U?si=GYKyOl4FuqpWD-5a

QuasiUnaFantasia

Pete14 Regarding “the pictures,” I still maintain that “Frankenstein” best represents samples

That was also my point.

pianow

samples: between the two of us, one is better then you

modeling: thanks, wait what?

pianow

Pete14 we know who the winner is,

clearly you don't, otherwise why would you love the terminators?

Pete14

QuasiUnaFantasia

Thank you, Quasi!

And whilst I don’t see modeling as “The Terminator,” I’d still rather be that than clumsy Frankenstein, “fire bad!”🔥

I’ll say one thing: modeling will most certainly exterminate samples, so yes, in that way modeling is an exterminator of sorts!

https://youtu.be/Mawve_3NSj4?si=KCvxWIQoX1s6LBMO

pianow

yay, keep dreaming🥴

David Lai

pianow Well played, really!

pianow

David Lai

thanks Davy🤍

HeartKeys

Okay, i spent a lot of time playing the VSL 280VC this week, and I continue to have new observations:

Yes, it sounds quite real. Frame of reference: my acoustic 280VC.
The bass, as portrayed within VSL 280VC, is the fattest, richest, bombastic out of all the VSL's. If I'm comparing acoustics, my experience is that the CFX and Imperial rival, or are slightly "better" or "less better" than the 280VC. But on VSL, I like the 280VC the most. By far. Most likely due to it being in Stage B. If one isn't careful, and hits it super hard, it could feel a bit "whiplash." Which... I much rather have (ie., "too much" capability where you have to tone it down, versus "too little" and hoping to get more out of it).
For going to sleep music (think of any playlist on music streaming services, of "Sleep Piano") I still prefer the other Stage B pianos over the 280VC. Specifically, the Fazioli F212 is still my favorite for that (the VSL F212 sounds wayyy more intimate and warm compared to the F212 acoustic I played, which was very poorly prepared).
I think it's great for most classical, jazz. When playing super-contemporary stuff (e.g., I play things like Robert Glasper, modern pop, modern Neo Soul, R&B, etc as well) , I absolutely like it more than any of the VSL offerings. It sounds both regal and bombastic.

All of the above commentary is subjective, as I don't claim to be an authority, in any shape or form. But I do have an acoustic 280VC, and I do have all the VSL's as comparisons.

Ultimately, I think it's a privilege/blessing/etc to have these various instruments. Instead of saying which is the best (which can be argued ad nauseam), I'm learning to appreciate the heck out of all of them.

jdg78

HeartKeys If one isn't careful, and hits it super hard, it could feel a bit "whiplash." Which... I much rather have (ie., "too much" capability where you have to tone it down, versus "too little" and hoping to get more out of it).

I love the 280VC, but I definitely feel the need to "tone things down" a bit, as it is simply comes off as too flinty and aggressive for me in stock form. But with some minor adjustments to the velocity curve and some other areas, it can be tamed quite nicely. And I agree it probably feels the most "real" of all the VSL grands (although the Bluthner feels equally real to me). But overall, I tend to lean towards the Imperial more - it has a certain depth and richness to the tone that I love.

HeartKeys Specifically, the Fazioli F212 is still my favorite for that (the VSL F212 sounds wayyy more intimate and warm compared to the F212 acoustic I played, which was very poorly prepared).

For the life of me, I can't get excited about the F212, and it's not for lack of trying. It simply feels hazy and unfocused to me, and nothing I do in the settings seems to make it come together in a way I find convincing. But I know there are many who love it, so I guess it's just not my cup of tea.

HeartKeys Ultimately, I think it's a privilege/blessing/etc to have these various instruments. Instead of saying which is the best (which can be argued ad nauseam), I'm learning to appreciate the heck out of all of them.

Agree 100%. I rotate through all of them regularly and there are qualities to appreciate about each one.

pianow

jdg78 And I agree it probably feels the most "real" of all the VSL grands (although the Bluthner feels equally real to me). But overall, I tend to lean towards the Imperial more - it has a certain depth and richness to the tone that I love.

it felt like I'm reading my own comment, hell yea that's exactly how i feel about these instruments, i find the imperial to be a little (or a lot) more open sounding then the 280vc, with that one (which I love) it feels like you're in a room and that's nice until you try the fff range, feels trapped tbh, of course no producer uses something like vsl280vc for dynamically loud and orchestral music, but when playing, it really doesn't feel safe to bang on the keys, with the imperial i don't have such problem and the entire dynamic range is usable to me (and it sounds warm even in ffff range)

pianow

HeartKeys Ultimately, I think it's a privilege/blessing/etc to have these various instruments. Instead of saying which is the best (which can be argued ad nauseam), I'm learning to appreciate the heck out of all of them

it's actually ridiculous, the amount of options we have these days is nuts, i remember a time that i had a single piano vst and i never gave a damn about its bugs or anything, but now even the best pianos are not satisfying 😂 yea but i completely agree with you, i appreciate what vsl's doing and am happy about their pianos (and honestly everything else they release)
even the f308 is growing up on me, I've found its qualities and im happy about it, to be honest it's my 2nd favourite among the Stage a pianos now (ans you know who's the first right? lemme put it this way : the one who doesn't have sharp edges or deafening brightness, yea😄)

honestly all the stage b pianos are incredible imo, i didn't like the f212 though, it feels like a lot of work, it reminds me of their steinway (not sound wise, they're completely the opposite in that regard, but the fact that i have to tweak the hell outta it to be able to make it work, i wish they'd release a steinway b and a Yamaha c7 one day)

pianow

one more thing
my bosendorfer imperial demo License is expired today😭 i have to wait at least two months to get it (and that's only possible if vsl would include it in the black Friday sale)

i compared it to every single vsl piano and it gave most of them a shameless middle finger, i compared it to my old favourite (grandeur) and it was surprising how similar they sound, something in the recording side of things is incredibly similar (they're both successfully captured the whole warmth and roundness of the instrument in a big hall without sacrificing a tiny bit of clarity and that imo means i need to fu9king buy it), i love this thing.
it sounds very romantic and resonant, i can even hear the big wooden cabinet of the instrument vibrating in the samples, the recording level is in another galaxy, i believe that vsl changed recipe with the imperial and that's because it was a huge step up from their steinway (at least IMO)

btw I'm waiting for a good price, even I can't convince myself to spend 600$ on a virtual instrument.

David Lai

pianow btw I'm waiting for a good price, even I can't convince myself to spend 600$ on a virtual instrument.

It's quite expensive, I don't blame ya. 🙂 Hope something good can come of this November.

pianow

David Lai

540 euros? like really???
it's not like I'm buying a new computer or something, it's a vst💀

pianow

i bought the 280vc for 240$ And i still think it was quite expensive (not for what it is, but in general)
but 600$ is just ridiculous, I've been in love with one of Lewitt mics (lct 540s - 700$) for almost two and half years and i could never convince myself that it's gonna be a worthy purchase (even though it sounds great and can compete with the mics three times more expensive)

i ended up buying a 300$ mic, so vsl stuff are ridiculously expensive, especially for a country like mine with a very low currency.

jdg78

pianow btw I'm waiting for a good price, even I can't convince myself to spend 600$ on a virtual instrument.

It is a lot to spend at once. My method was always to purchase the standard version first when VSL was running a sale, and then upgrade to the full version later on down the road during another sale period. They usually have at least 2 a year.

It lessens the financial blow and allows you to play the standard version for months while you save up for the full.

You can also often find people selling their licenses on the VI Control forums. I’ve seen VSL Bosendorfer Imperial licenses offered several times over the past few years, often for less than VSL’s discounted price.

David Lai

jdg78 You can also often find people selling their licenses on the VI Control forums. I’ve seen VSL Bosendorfer Imperial licenses offered several times over the past few years, often for less than VSL’s discounted price.

Can you tell me how to sell my Steinway STD license? I've been wanting to do so for years, but don't know: 1 how to name a good price, and 2, how to go about this sale?

Thanks!

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