MrGr There's a volume knob which is a pot BTW, not an encoder, and works great controlling the volume of the currently selected track in Logic.
P.S. But it's still mostly a cheap controller. I guess the Akai-s are more valued and supposedly better controllers. Nektar-s are not very highly regarded AFAIK.
CyberGene "pot" means I can switch between MIDI 0…127 values at arbitrary speed just limited by how fast I turn the knob?
MrGr "pot" means I can switch between MIDI 0…127 values at arbitrary speed just limited by how fast I turn the knob?
What you describe is an encoder: the encoders are limitless in motion but if you turn them slow enough you won't generate any data. Potentiometers are limited mechanically from left to right but you can turn them as slow as you want and the exact actual position will be taken. However I haven't experimented a lot and I'm not sure how exactly that worked in Logic, I mean since you change between different tracks with different volume and you have a pot with actual position that doesn't correspond to the current track volume, what strategy was implemented: e.g. immediately jump to the pot value or only change the value when you reach the actual value and do nothing before that. If you are interested, I will check that for you?
P.S. Encoders are good for these situations where you reuse the same encoder for different tracks or parameters, since it doesn't have any absolute current value/position. Instead, the encoder only generates an increase or decrease to the actual value. But the disadvantage is that if you need precision, the encoders don't work well because the slow movements do not generate changes. The best, albeit expensive, strategy is like on the expensive mixer consoles in the studio that have motorized pot faders and pot knobs 🙂
well, I can rotate the knobs on my MPK249 endlessly. However, it only generates values from 0…127. Seems like the MPK takes a physical encoder and limits it to a potentiometer function when sending out the MIDI values……. can't even tell it to send encoder values to Reaper (I could tell Reaper to use value 64 as baseline and the difference from that as decrement/increment - I wonder if there are any keyboards out there that support that type of operation - maybe it's better to put such controls into a separate device).
MrGr well, I can rotate the knobs on my MPK249 endlessly. However, it only generates values from 0…127. Seems like the MPK takes a physical encoder and limits it to a potentiometer function when sending out the MIDI values
Well, that is normal for encoders. You can turn it endlessly but when it reaches the maximum value the software understands, it won't generate more, although you turn it. And the same for the lower values. To be frank, I prefer encoders but not for everything. I don't like the potentiometer behavior where the pot is physically at it maximum, for example, and you use it for something that has actual current value of 0. Then if you start turning the potentiometer back, depending on configuration it would either immediately jump the value it drives to maximum which creates an audible jump that is not desirable if that's a live recorded sound, or will require that you first turn the pot fully to the left until it reaches minimum after which it will "catch" the value and will affect it.
No perfect world 🙂
CyberGene pretty much yeah, if the knob controls all sorts of stuff depending on a changing context, then I agree. For volume however, I prefer faders with absolute values.
btw. here is an endless encoder array: https://store.djtechtools.com/products/midi-fighter-twister
and I just discovered that there is a hidden (not really) configuration option to switch the knobs of my mpk into relative mode. Neat. If it weren't for the ghosting.
CyberGene I guess the Akai-s are more valued and supposedly better controllers.
Hello,
My brother (with an amazing number of hours at keyboards I'll never ever catch up with) uses the AKAI Professional MPK 261 and is very happy with it.
He uses it for his DAWs, software synths, and his hardware synths as well -- even if they have their own keyboards.
Cheers and happy master controlling,
HZ
MrGr I just discovered that there is a hidden (not really) configuration option to switch the knobs of my mpk into relative mode. Neat. If it weren't for the ghosting.
Hello,
Wow, that sure is neat!
To a (relative) layman like me: what actually is 'ghosting'? (All I know is to never cross the streams 🤭).
Cheers and happy controlling,
HZ
HZPiano Ghosting means that a ghost is controlling your device, ie. the controls emit events for no reason, or they get triggered by the use of other controls. Heavily used Akai products seem to be known to have such issues after one or two years. In my case hitting the keys a little harder produces slider events with values 0-5 or so. Looks like internal dust/crumbs closing contacts or something like that. I once had a new VPC-1 which showed similar effects: hitting some keys a little harder triggered also other keys….
I'm always amazed how bad many products out there are. And still get tons of 5 star reviews. I think websites should really start to categorize those reviews into categories like "new", "played a bit for a year", "pleyed a ton for 3 years" and then also accumulate those reviews over brands and product lines so we get a better overview of how reliable this stuff is. It's not as if such issues would be new for Akai. Their predecessor line MPK had similar issues. TBF the quality has improved a bit, the sliders have a better quality feel now, but the electronics is still crap.
Which brings me to another question: is there any database out there that lays out the lifetime of various products?
Hello,
I see. A gut feeling says a really thorough internal cleaning and checking might be in order. But as said that is a gut feeling, not actual experience.
Cheers and good luck,
HZ
HZPiano yeah that's the next thing I'll try. Though that type of issues shouldn't be there in the first place. I could understand if contacts wear out, but not really the other way round.
Hi!
How are you about your GXP49 about one month later?
As you know I'm looking at 61-key boards for Hammond simming. I'm currently testing the Casio CT-S1 (and pleasantly surprised with it on first impression) and will receive their cheapest option, the Casio CT-S100 later today for a comparison.
The only other keyboard I can think of below €250 that might be something is the GXP61.
However, it seems to be semi-weighted, which may not be a match for organ-style playing. The CT-S1 has a very slight weight on the keys (from springs, I assume) and that is just on the border between acceptable and a tad too much. They might loosen up over time, I don't know.
What would you say, from your experience with the 49, about the GXP61 as an option?
Cheers and thanks!
HZ
HZPiano I really like it. Taking in mind the price, there seems to be no other real competition for a 4-octave synth key controller with aftertouch. I don’t like the slightly clacky keys (they clack on release, probably stopped by hard surface) but it doesn’t affect the touch or feel. Another odd effect is the keys seem to be sticky on first push after a few hours of rest which is why when I start using it I always do a glissando over the white and black keys to unglue them and then it’s OK 😀
In pictures it seems the 61-key version has piano like keys with vertical front surface of the keys whereas on mine you can look beneath the keys. Not sure if it’s just a visual thing or the key dip and spring weight are different though. It’s something you may want to double-check.
CyberGene it seems the 61-key version has piano like keys with vertical front surface of the keys whereas on mine you can look beneath the keys.
Aha! I hadn't noticed that. And thanks for answering this swiftly.
Probably the 61's keys are not the exact same keybed, then. Maybe I should order one to just check it out myself, but it is a bit of a chore all those tests and returns 😲. Yet it's the only way to try, having no useable stores anywhere nearby…
Again thanks and cheers,
HZ
CyberGene when I start using it I always do a glissando over the white and black keys to unglue them
Strange…
When you do the glissando ("palm smear" in Hammond terms 😋), do the keys rattle against eachother from (too much) lateral movement or can they cope with such 'abuse'?
The Casio I am testing now is virtually silent (nice!) if played normally but does rattle with 'smears'. I reckon most cheap (and even not-so-cheap) keybeds do.
Cheers!
HZ
HZPiano When you do the glissando ("palm smear" in Hammond terms 😋), do the keys rattle against eachother from (too much) lateral movement or can they cope with such 'abuse'?
They rattle like hell (hell, I can write hell on this forum without it being replaced with heck!) but otherwise seem they can take the abuse. To be honest, I'm not sure if this keyboard is good for Hammond, I've never tried a real one but I imagine it being much lighter, quieter and with shallower key-dip, so maybe the Nektar is not optimal.
CyberGene They rattle like hell
Hell! And thanks.
With your input added, I'll declare the Nektar unsuitable for my purpose, with thanks for saving me the trouble.
Meanwhile, I took a closer look at photos of the 61; the fronts of the keys look rather odd to me:
So, to get myself going with Hammond-ish playing, it'll probably be one of the Casios, or otherwise I'll put the whole idea to rest for a bit.
Here's where my experimentation led to so far (not the final setup, just experimental):
With on top the 'drawbars' and other controls 'programmed' in a cheap-but-nice-enough little MIDI fader controller.
Cheers and again thanks,
HZ