Hi all , in case you haven’t seen it on moddart board there is a new midi controller being developed .

https://playvidal.com/products/vidal?variant=43089817403543

More info also on their instagram (play vidal)

Quite exclusive , and highly price , although not unreasonable, I like the concept of having immediate access to the keys and it looks absolutely stunning . Hope it plays as good as it looks , but in all cases it’s good to see small entrepreneurs entering the market with high quality stuff .

I don't see anything about the action, only vague descriptions about it being "simplified", "smallest profile for a hammer action" and "the best feeling" which are all contradictory IMO. Besides, I usually don't trust manufacturers when they say they made the best feeling action since they all say so but at the end it's often not true 😀

3000€ is important for a pre-order of a controller whose the quality of the keyboard should be tested before purchase.

I reserve the "buy without testing" for a 200€ keyboard (and was disappointed).

To each their own, but I find it basic and ugly; looking more like a desk with keys.

Regarding their “exaggerated” claims, I’ll say this:

Exaggerated claims require exaggerated evidence!😁

Yeah, I don't get it. Where does it get the inertial feeling of throwing a hammer? They only show a keybed.

I guess initial reviews will give more info about it , but from a pure business standpoint , I understand why they stay relatively vague at this stage given the product is not live yet . But maybe there is a tiny chance that this is innovative . I still remember when the newton smartphone was introduced , industry reaction was to say there was no future for smartphones 😉 . From a price standpoint , I also find it way too high and looking more like a patreon type of funding . There should be a large discount for a pre order at this stage . Regarding the look, I don’t like the website pictures , but the pictures and video on their instagram account look pretty nice

Joannchr Nice! One other thing ….. did they forget to put in the felt strip?

MIDI controllers that feel like a concert grand. Real wood keys, our own patented Magnet Action, and a real hardwood case.

nice craftsmanship and looks like a fun piano to design and build.

"Fully Weighted Hammer Action" and "We also radically simplified the action. With only two moving parts per key, we think it might be the most reliable real-wood keyboard ever made."

Looks like no hammers at all, even though they call it "Hammer Action". Pivot length looks really long, you can see the pcb on the side in the picture, and they responded to someone that they are using membrane switches (?)

"ONLY two moving parts per key" seems a common design: the key and the hammer.

Frédéric L "ONLY two moving parts per key" seems a common design: the key and the hammer.

😄

Yes, exactly what I thought when I read that.

Cheers and… "happy" marketing,

HZ

dore_m Pivot length looks really long

LONG??? That is an understatement... The pivot length looks like 40 cms!!! Eat dust Steinway and all your sons...

Unless... the back pin is just a stabilizer and the mid pin (the one without bushing) is the real pivot, and in that case the pivot length is in fact only 16-17 cms, which is a really stupid decision. My bet is that the mid pin is where the SPRINGS are placed (yeah springs...)

No disrespect towards Vidal but browsing through their Instagram I see they are piano technicians and with that in mind I would speculate they are just some guys who didn’t really live in the digital piano/keyboard world, they haven’t probably read a single thread in a forum like ours. I even doubt they played and tested many digital keyboards. I think they just thought how knowledgeable they must be being piano technicians, so let them create a digital keyboard with all that knowledge. I believe they are not reading the forum, as I said, so hopefully they won’t be insulted by what I think of them: they’re just ignorant. Not as a whole. As digital keyboard builders.

And I hope that thought this through correctly, because if our pivot length is REALLY long, you also need to increase a lot the spacing between the lines of the membrane switches (either 2 or 3 contacts... does not matter) to compensate for the smaller "rotational" effect of the key. If you use PCBs with a similar spacing as in regular DPs, both pads will be activated in very quick succession, which is not a problem by itself, but means that there is absolutely no room for any manufacturing irregularity. Any small tilt in the PCB or any difference in the distance of each wooden key to the PCB (hello humidity!!!) will make the midi reading jump as crazy.

and unless I'm mistaken, membrane switches are really crappy for sensing velocity. That's what they use in cheap TV remote controls. I'm no expert at DP actions - do any good ones use membrane switches?

So should I order a piano that's not yet in production? And that's been tried and evaluated by no one?

Kinda reminds me of Pelosi-era House bills. "You've gotta pass the bill before you get to read it."

Nope. Not for me.

It seems “Vidal” has been around for quite some time, yet only recently did they venture into the ‘digital piano’ business.

I must say, if their pianos turn out to be anything like their hair products, I’m all in:

https://youtu.be/Tmt3Q9qclTE

I tease, yet do I?😆

dore_m and unless I'm mistaken, membrane switches are really crappy for sensing velocity. That's what they use in cheap TV remote controls. I'm no expert at DP actions - do any good ones use membrane switches?

They don't use them to sense velocity from a single such sensor. They are used as binary switches instead, placed in a specific way, so that they are mechanically pressed in succession (e.g. they are pressed by notches of different length), so that time is measured between the two activations, hence velocity can be devised. That's why there are "two-sensor" and "triple-sensor" actions.

vagfilm And I hope that thought this through correctly, because if our pivot length is REALLY long, you also need to increase a lot the spacing between the lines of the membrane switches (either 2 or 3 contacts... does not matter) to compensate for the smaller "rotational" effect of the key.

From the photo, the fulcrum seems to be at the far rear side and the sensors (the little green part of PCB we see) half way. Then there are still some movement to measure (half the shift of the front of the key). Note, sensors don't measure a "rotational" effect. Only a movement of the part of the key on the top of it.