Displacing the acoustic piano in the middle-class household

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This thread is not about asking the question what kind of instrument one thinks is "superior" or "outdated" in their opinion. The question is actually if the availability of simple folded-action digital pianos are going to displace the acoustic piano in the general middle-class household.

Is it that where used to be an decent upright piano there is now some sub-$1000-slab with single layer samples on a stand, which is considered entirely appropriate by the demographic? What will this do to children hearing only canned piano sounds instead of strings for their entire life?

Drew-r

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I think it will in many cases compliment doing to the average child what is and has long been increasingly done by modern culture, that includes children in the classroom taught by government and outside the classroom taught by the ubiquitous media/entertainment apparatus which is mostly the same government in tooty-fruity disguise.

On numerous fronts, it has been made extremely difficult to instill, so as to pass on, family values and traditions. Traditional art broadly, music specifically, has long been a victim of modern progress.

Monoch

Deleted where used to be an decent upright piano

I'm not sure if it used to be a "decent" upright piano. In the past, cheap and terrible acoustic pianos were ubiquitous, especially in households. Over the years, the average build and tonal quality of acoustic pianos has increased dramatically. So IMO, the cheap folded action DPs have simply replaced the cheap (and unmaintained and untuned) acoustic pianos. One could argue that that is actually a change for the better, rather than for the worse, for at least, the children hearing it will hear it in tune.

Households that really value good quality instruments will still go for the better acoustic, as it was in the past.

vagfilm

Well… I am all for the democratization and dissemination of musical instruments… Any instrument… Anything else is very close to being a form of desguised elitism. At least in my country, there are certainly more households now with some kind of keyboard-based instrument than ever was. And I don't think there is any statistical evidence that kids that experience tones from a string stay in piano classes longer than those that hear "canned" sounds (I assume it is quite the contrary). I will take those canned sounds any day of the year instead of old uprights that cannot be played at all hours or are so beyond any hope of repair that cannot stay tuned for more than a few weeks.

Drew-r

vagfilm

What i see may be localized to where i live compared to others of you, ergo the dismal tone of my previous post.

Example: as a boy in the early 70’s, the (small, rural community) high school band had over 100 members, they practiced year round, often in full regalia even during summer months, travelled near & far to compete and perform “cavalcade” , there were several music teachers for grades 1-6, plus a teacher and a music department each at both the junior and senior high schools, plus numerous private teachers nearby. Manyof these band members played 2 or more instruments, lots of them also sang and studied piano and there were at least 10 music stores in the county. Today, there is one music store still in business, several years the past 15 the band barely had enough members to field an instrument-less marching color guard “band” and overall there seems to be little interest or initiative for children to learn music.

vagfilm

Again, there is more under the sun than one's personal experiences… But the point is: in the negative progression that you describe over the last 50 years, what would have been avoided or somehow improved if the "folded" digital pianos would have never seen the light of day?

Drew-r

vagfilm

I think the “folded action” is just another sign, one among many, of an overall condition ….. that further paints the picture of degradation so to speak. Absent just the DP, i do not think the overall condition would have been avoided …. the nature of gradualism - by creep - has slowly degraded the old world of Art as a whole …..you want a genuine example of a blight on this world, familiarize a bit with the history of and the movers/shakers in the advent of wrecking ball - MoMA.

Ralphiano

My only access to music as a youngster was listening to professional performers through a cheap and poor quality radio. That experience did not impair my desire for and appreciation for music in any way that I can recognize. So, I don't think the weaker sounds of a digital piano presents much threat to the budding desire for music among the young.

I do think there could easily be a diminution of the desire cultivated within an aspiring pianist by an acoustic if that aspirant only has access to a digital.

EB5AGV

Ralphiano Yesterday I attended to a choral concert. They, about 50 people, sang along a Roland DP player and a multi-instrument player (flute and other wind instruments and some percussion, one at a time of course). The girl (she would be about 18 or so) played beautifully and was really immersed in music. I enjoyed the concert basically for her performance!. So there is still some hope that some young people is not absorbed by the easier social networks and video streaming which glues most of them to the displays doing nothing useful for most of their free time.

Where I live there is a music band with about 40 members and they have promoted a music school (which I attend for the fourth year)

Music (real one, no urban trash) is struggling everywhere, but there is hope on this kind of initiatives.

QuasiUnaFantasia

I agree much with drew-r. There has been a gradual degradation of the appreciation of traditional art, or maybe a twisting of the definition of what art is. I think Tracy Emin's success in failing to make her bed speaks volumes about the "elite" approach to art.

Another sign of the times is the fact that you can buy acoustic uprights for nothing any day of the year, because loads of instruments are being un-wanted by people moving house (in most cases they never played; the instrument was played by a parent, or even a grandparent).

But I don't really believe that true art is no longer appreciated by anyone; those instinctively inclined towards it will still find it.

Irmin

I think the Youtube has fundamentally changed the 'art of piano' as well as what is considered 'normal' in terms of owning an instrument.

As a child I remember that many households had an upright. Also if we used to go to our state theatre to listen to accomplished musicians, be it a soloist or with orchestra.

Today there are 1000's of 'pianists' on Youtube. Many of them are mediocre but you'd think they are virtuosos if you look at the comments. Of course there are some amazing artists as well. Most of the pianists use digitals so I think that has made the use of a digital normal as well.

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Personally I haven't seen musical instruments "trickle down" to lower classes. The latter are still mainly concerned with screen entertainment (TV, streaming and video games).

I just noticed how the typical not very well maintained acoustic upright piano, which has been tuned every few years has been downgraded to FP-10, P-45 an likes within the typical demographics. The unwanted acoustic pianos didn't appear outside the suburbs, nor did any $500-1500 digitals. So from my PoV I don't see any dissemination happening.

What's interesting from my perspective: I only see this downward spiral happening for piano. The guitar is still alive and well. Acoustic guitars sell like hotcakes and the electric guitar is having a blast with people spending thousands on single "reliced" instruments. With stacks of loud tube amps at home they aren't worried at all about neighbors, but still refrain from purchasing anything beyond a mediocre ES520.

It is as if the real piano lost its standing entirely and became reduced to a boombox with a folded action, because it doesn't deserve being more than that. And that's something that I view with concern.

MacMacMac

Deleted Personally I haven't seen musical instruments "trickle down" to lower classes. The latter are still mainly concerned with screen entertainment (TV, streaming and video games).

I think it was Larry Fine who attributed the decline to the media, starting over a century ago. First the phonograph. Then radio. Those are cheap. And require no skill. So the piano went into decline.

When he wrote that it was well before the explosion of internet based media. The decline continues.

As for other instruments holding their own ... keep in mind that other instruments are far cheaper than an acoustic piano. Even a cheap, low-end console costs over $3000. You can get started on a guitar for far less money.

Also, high-school bands (and middle school, too) are the starting point for many young musicians. It's hard to march in a band with a piano keyboard, eh? So the latter is absent from that curriculum. My girls played flute, piccolo, and clarinet.

My eldest picked up a little (self-taught) piano just because I had an upright in the house. But she's now grown, married, and has a son ... and no piano. But she finds plenty of time for "the media" ... like binge watching whatever show is new, hip, and cool on Netflix.