Dynamics: should there be a Mozart setting?

QuasiUnaFantasia

When Beethoven wanted "loud" from a piano, he did not take "no" for an answer, and so he demolished piano's until the piano makers made them sturdy enough to deliver the dynamics asked by him. Today, piano's have an even larger dynamic range than in his day, and surely he would have enjoyed that.

But what about Mozart, and his contemporaries? Their reality was piano's with a much reduced dynamic range from the one we are accustomed to. And if we want to play their music on a modern instrument, we have to utilize a much smaller part of the dynamic range. Great pianists probably do this as a matter of course, but for us mere mortals, who don't possess that level of fine control, playing Mozart correctly becomes quite a task.

So my thinking is that VI's could come with the possibility to change dynamic range. Bear in mind that timbre and volume are dissociated in VI's, so you could retain the full range of timbre while reducing that of volume. And because there are always 127 MIDI levels, the reduced dynamic range would automatically allow more subtle control over the volume within the dynamic range.

Should VI's have a "Tchaikovsky" setting, and a "Mozart" setting? My gut feeling is "hell, yeah!"

Pete14

QuasiUnaFantasia When Beethoven wanted "loud" from a piano, he did not take "no" for an answer, and so he demolished piano's until the piano makers made them sturdy enough to deliver the dynamics asked by him. Today, piano's have an even larger dynamic range than in his day, and surely he would have enjoyed that.

But what about Mozart, and his contemporaries? Their reality was piano's with a much reduced dynamic range from the one we are accustomed to….

Layman walking:

But still, as a layman, I have a right to an opinion, god damn it!

I am of the opinion that Beethoven might’ve inadvertently messed up ‘the piano,’ given that his deafness lead him to ask for unrealistically loud(er) pianos; so I ask, isn’t it true that a ‘louder’ piano necessitates a deeper key-bed, and that the deeper key-beds got, in order to accommodate a louder spectrum, the keys also became wider, and the piano, itself, heavier & bulkier (in order to handle all that pounding from Van & Liszt).

Disclaimer: I love Van, and I forgive him for his excesses, for it was his handicap that led him to such extreme demands, “I can’t hear the god damn piano; make it louder, I say!”

But it’s that Liszt guy I hate, for the only reason he asked for louder pianos was out of vanity and to sell more tickets (larger & larger audiences), so that he could show off his King-Kong-Sized hands 🙌 shame on him!

Joannchr

Pete14 with all my respect Pete , I beg to differ , Beethoven has been asking for louder pianos since 1795 when first of his concertos was written. At this time Beethoven hearing was normal . One of the key difference between baroque concert and classical period is that during Bach time and classical period was that baroque venues were intimate as venues started to be much larger in Beethoven ‘ time .

Joannchr

Joannchr EDIT : sorry for the typo , I meant , venues started to be much larger in the beginning of the classical period . The key issue which still is problematic sometimes is in concertos when the piano competes with an orchestra ( fff at 120DB ) . typical pieces that are still problematic, arpeggios of 1st movement 2nd concerto Rachmaninov , last bars on Ravel concerto die left hand where you have to strike the keys with force to be be heard.

dore_m

@QuasiUnaFantasia are you talking about the volume dial? Just kidding.

Pete14

Surely, the official date of Beethoven’s deafness was withheld from the public for many years before it was “officially” revealed, and had it not been for him being caught in the act (of not hearing), we never might’ve found out about his deafness.

It turns out Ludwig was in cahoots with his assistant/disciple/girlfriend, and whilst people spoke to Ludwig, she stood behind them signaling (sign language), so that Ludwig would pretend he could hear every word, and respond accordingly; however, one day, whilst entertaining an aristocrat, the conversation got very convoluted and the assistant/disciple/girlfriend could not keep up; leaving Ludwig stranded in the dark. The aristocrat noticed this, and then further propagated the news/gossip, “he’s deaf,” which further led to inquisitive minds testing Ludwig without the presence of his assistant, “can you hear me now….!”

It was only then that he admitted he’d just gone deaf “a few weeks ago,” but it turns out he’d been deaf for years prior, yet nobody noticed.

I have this from the most reliable source of them all: the man, himself! For he appears to me at night to shoot the breeze, play billiards, and gossip ‘bout Mozart!

CyberGene

Pete14 was that girl by any chance called Elise?

Joannchr

Pete14

For sure there is possibly some speculation about his deafness . Having said that, there is no doubt that the venues for public concertos and symphonies were calling for louder instruments anyway. Here is a picture of the Theater an der Wien where the famous 1818 Beethoven took place ( 5 and 6th symphony & Concerto no 4)) took place. No clavichord, Harpsichord could fill the space and early pianos were not loud enough when playing with a full orchestra.

Pete14

CyberGene was that girl by any chance called Elise?

Yes!

And I wonder, how did you know?

Does Van show up at your front steps at night, too?

Surely, I can’t be the only one he visits; although he insists, “you’re the only one, Pete,” but I think he’s just being polite, you know, to make me feel good.

P.S.

Yes, he hates Liszt, but oddly enough, he’s fond of Kenny G! I know, it’s baffling, but then again, the man is a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma, and sometimes I simply can’t tell if he’s being genuine, or simply pulling my leg, but I tell you, he looked me straight in the eye, and said, “Kenny G is fine!”

CyberGene

Pete14 Does Van show up at your front steps at night, too?

Yes, and he told me that Elise was mad when she learned that on top of drinking too much wine with a friend of him each night, Van also wrote a sonata for that prick Waldstein! She would make poor Van sleep on the couch for weeks until he finally composed something für her too. But he told me the piece was not actually für her but actually a musical portrait of the b1@tch: relentlessly annoying!

Pete14

🤣